Hey, I watched your video, thank you SO MUCH for sharing your reactions to the game, it's always a pleasure to read!! And I have to agree, Dylan did a STELLAR job on Hippolytus! I hope part 3 doesn't disappoint, it's definitely the most dramatic of the three lol!
Aw damn, the contrast between Hippolytus as this brave, proud young man, but still so innocent and naive that he doesn't even know what to do with Phaedra's twisted affection and even victim blamed himself for her feelings, is just so poignant. There may be more to the story, but I feel for him in this moment 😔
But for now, I read his reluctance in killing Phaedra to be out of fear, yes, perhaps pity, but also a sliver of kindness. Because, aside from this twisted affection, she's still just any other woman. His step-mother, no less. She's not a beast. Not a monster. Just a flawed woman with a twisted affection. She doesn't deserve to be killed. Not even rapists of the highest degree are sentenced to death. What she needs is therapy and rehabilitation. As they say, hate the sin, not the sinner.
I've struggled with that mindset myself. After all, I've been and am abused and want nothing more but punishment to those who have wronged me. But... It's true that we are all still human in the end. Every one of us deserves a second chance ( well, within reasons, lol ). Punishments, death sentences, those are just an easy way out...
Ofc, all victims and survivors still have the right to exercise their boundaries, which means they don't have to forgive those abusers nor even breathe the same air as them. No one can nor should talk them into it either. It's 100% their right and choice to make. The sinner's redemption shall not and will never be the victim/survivor's responsibility to see through.
That's what Phaedra pushed onto Hippolytus. She chose to take an easy way out. She wanted Hippolytus to take responsibility. When it's supposed to be her sin and hers alone.
And this is how Hippolytus wound up blaming himself. Amidst all his confusion and fear and failure in felling her, he directed all that frustration onto himself. After all, what is an easier target but yourself?
Haa, yep, very relatable story to me. Fortunately, I've never been taken advantage of in that way by a family member, but yeah, many similar cycles when it comes to familial abuse.
I feel for him. I wish I could reach out and hug him. Tell him it's not his fault. Tell him it's not his reponsibility to help Phaedra get her easy way out. Tell him that it's okay. Everything will be okay.
As for my opinion on the first entry now; I'm disappointed but not surprised Phaedra killed herself. From the first moment of rejection, she was looking for an easy way out for her feelings and harassment. Although at the very least, I'm glad she didn't wait around for Hippolytus to kill her. That she at least realized what she did was wrong.
And I guess that's the tragedy. Instead of improving herself, instead of apologizing and talking things through, to then live with the guilt of her sin, she chose to end the chapter of her life. Her easy way out.
At least, that's the way I see it.
I'm also shocked to find out Ariadne killed herself. She didn't deserve that, goddammit :' )
But yeah, this one is even more impactful than the first, Chim! So hella bravo! Congrats on slipping my hypeman mask for a sec and peeked at the person beneath 😝 Solid 10/10 for the writing! 🥳✨💞
For the art direction~ Holy heck! How did you do the part with the sun going all ripply?! That was hella cool and intense!! I need a tutorial ahsjksls-- 😭🤲🏻💞💞 But yeah! I love most of the art direction! Even better than the first one! I do wonder what's the purpose of the Hippolytus parallax effect tho? Owo Breaks immersion a bit for me, but nothing major, so is okie 😁👌🏻✨
The voice acting? To be honest, at first the delivery was quite rough and sounded like the VA was trying too hard to sound dramatic, but throughout the game, I could hear the VA actually improving on their delivery and the parts where they yell were actually truly intense! So mad props on that! Improving within just one project takes real skill, so yeh! Am impressed 😳👌🏻✨💞
As for improvement feedback~ The music volume issue is there, ofc, so I won't comment on it further. Unfortunately, it also extends to the voice acting volume. Probably because you were trying to balance it out with the yelling parts? But yeah, it resulted in the non-yelling parts sounding really low, even at 100%. There were even parts where I could barely hear the voice at all. Not sure if you've fixed it for the last entry, but I'll say it here anyway, seeing as the music volume issue persisted 🙉🤲🏻
But good news! This time, I didn't catch any typos! So major props for that! This is enough proof* that you can fight the curse, yayy!! 🥳✨💞
So yeah, really impactful sequel, Chim! You made me feel things! How dare agshsk-- 😭🤲🏻💦✨💞 Another 9.5/10 game for me 😌👌🏻💞💞
Now, what things shall I unearth when I play the last one tomorrow... Lowkey scared, but also hyped 👀💦✨💞
*Edited for a typo. Goddammit-- I guess your curse transferred to me, smh 😤😤
Your reading is very interesting here! Admittedly, this whole series is meant to be up to interpretation but your take is surprisingly empathetic towards Phaedra. It does make sense though: what I got from abuse is that, even when you see your abusers commit the most inhuman things, you also see how vulnerable they are. And while I think that nobody is unsavable (and that Phaedra deserves her rehabilitation), I do also believe that the victims aren't the one who need to save their abusers (not that you said that lol just sharing my thoughts).
And yes, Phaedra's sucicide even has one more consequence: she took it from Hippolytus, she stole the resolve he takes at the end of Son of the Woods (however, if I'm being honest, Hippolytus dies right after this game, hence the final background, with the sword stained with blood and the wave; it's the tragedy reaching him no matter what, and the wave is connected to the way he dies in the myth: dragged down by his horses, frightened of the sea monster Hippolytus just killed; players are free to interpret the ending as they wish, but I'll admit that's what I have in mind lol).
I'm glad you appreciated Hippolytus enough to want to comfort him, haha. For Ariadne, there are two versions of the myth: the most famous one narrates her marrying Dionysus, god of wine-making; however, another version, which is the one Racine followed in his play and that I followed myself here, is Ariadne committing suicide out of despair after being abandoned by Theseus, for whom she betrayed her father and her country (yeah, Ariadne would definitely deserve her own game loool).
For the voice acting, I'll admit I don't know how to make the volume of the voice lines louder without having it sound saturated, but yes, the issue will exist in nthe whole series efrgvbf; and for the wavy effect, I used Wattson's Ren'Py Wave Shader (cf. credits), but I'm glad you appreciated the effect!
Thanks for your feedback, excited to hear what you have to say of the final game! Hopefully you'll enjoy it, it sure is a wild ride (and is also longer than the two others combined haha).
Aaa, sorry for the late reply! Expected to reply and play the last part yesterday, but life really has a way of throwing you for a loop ahsjsl-- 🥴🤲🏻💦✨
But anyways! Yeah, I tend to be empathetic towards most people, so it's hard to ignore the vulnerable parts of Phaedra. It's one of my flaws, tbh. I get easily taken advantage of because of it. Now I overcompensate by NOT trusting a lot of real people, haha... Still trying to heal from it 😩🤲🏻
Oh no! Poor Hippolytus! Guy can't catch a break agsjsl-- 😭😭 Yeah, I can imagine he won't like Phaedra just killing herself from it cuz he already resolved himself to. If I were him, I'd be relieved, hence why I didn't think about that from the get go. Def fits his prideful personality better 😁👌🏻✨
Omg, yes! Ariadne deserves her own game for sure!! She's only side roles in these two entries but she already caught my heart, man 😭🤲🏻💞💞
I see! Damn. Ren'py sounds complicated than I initially thought. Major glad I decided to use RPG Maker MZ instead. Volume control is easier there 😂👉🏻👈🏻 And guess I can't use the shader when it's limited to Ren'py then. Oh well~ Still hella cool. I legit jumped in awe when it happened 😌👌🏻✨💞
You're welcome! Tbh, I'm still a bit drained from yesterday's life shenanigans ( since what happened could throw a wrench in my future, lol ), so I'm not sure if I'll have the energy to give feedback, but I'll see what I can do! Even if it's short or something 🥰💞 But I have no doubts I'll enjoy it, that's for sure! 😁🤲🏻✨💞
This was a terrific sequel to Daughters of the Sun! The voice actor did an excellent job and the writing was great! Hippolytus is such an interesting character, especially when you compare him to Phaedra. Phaedra blames Aphrodite for her feelings and for what happened to her mother and sister. While Phaedra is somewhat sympathetic, she is the one who fell in love with her own stepson, and seems to see herself as the victim. The real victim, Hippolytus, while also blaming Aphrodite and Phaedra, blames himself for the most part, wondering what he did to cause Phaedra to fall in love with him and upset that he couldn't strike her down like his father struck down her brother, the Minotaur. It's sad to see, especially because other victims in similar situations also tend to blame themselves instead of their attackers. This was heart wrenching but such a good game!
Hi again and thanks for your enthusiasm about the sequel!! You exactly caught it: The Daughters of the Sun is meant to paint Phaedra as a victim of a curse, and then Son of the Woods is meant to question this: is Phaedra trying to find excuses? Isn't Hippolytus the actual victim in this situation? Which is even more ironic considering Hippolytus, here, does see himself as a culprit, when he is, as you say "the real victim". And you also caught the deeper theme of it: self-inflicted victim-blaming.
I'm glad you enjoyed this game too, thanks for your support!! (And once again, I agree: the voice acting is excellent, Dylan was terrific in this role!!)
I spoke at length about the story in my recording of it lol (half the runtime was just me yapping lololol) but for those wondering if they should play-in short, absolutely! especially if you’ve played its predecessor “Daughters of the Sun”
I personally feel more attached to this part of the Phaedra tale as it captures a more relatable protagonist. And though it was horrifically beautiful to witness Phaedra's thoughts in DOTS it didn’t speak to me as much as Son of the Woods. It may sound silly to say with the gorgeous art and writing, but the sound design on this really shines to me! It really sucks you in how the darkest of thoughts find us in the safest/most serene places.
I am genuinely shocked that this project is shorter than DOTS- as I felt like they had the same runtime at the least! (Comparisons aside)
As its own piece of work, this is a very RAW entry. It doesn’t shy away with all the emotions that come from being a victim to a horrible crime. And how Hippolytus is no weaker or lesser because of it! It really sparks an important conversation between the biases of female predators to male.
I feel for Hippolytus and how he wants to “take responsibility” for his step mothers heinous actions/feelings- but the sad truth is we have no control on how others looks at us, and even how they treat us all the time. Even with all the power, influence, and strength we can all be victims.
Some people may find that last sentence terrifying, and in a way it is, but for me a victim myself- I find it empowering- I’m not alone in this and even if I could slay a Minotaur it could still happen to me.
I know Hippolytus and others like him, with the correct support system can come to terms with what happened and not blame himself- as well as not let others blame him.
As I said before, Chime thank you for tackling these heavy subjects with tact and thought! I can always tell you care what you are talking about and take a lot of responsibility with what you are saying! It’s one of the many things I admire about you and your body of work 💕
Ah, thanks for your insighftul comment, Joy, it was a delight to read, and I'm glad you enjoyed this game!
It was the point of the game: I know Phaedra's perception was vastly appreciated by the players of the Daughters of the Sun, sympathising with her, so this game is meant to offer the other side of the story and subvert the initial one! And I'm glad you could connect more with Hippolytus, because in the end, he is the victim after all. Also, thanks for noticing the sound design, I put efforts in it, haha!
Yes, the ending of the game is meant to be powerful, it's Hippolytus gaining agency over his abuse (well, in the actual myth, he dies while leaving Troezen but let's ignore that edfvgfedfvg).
And THANKS FOR THESE KIND FINAL WORDS, it makes me so happy, especially from someone who tackles relationships with so many nuances and care!! Thanks for your support, like always, Joy!!
This was an excellent follow-up to The Daughters of the Sun - the other half of the story, one that casts the former in a completely new light. I'll reserve my detailed comments on the game below, under the spoiler tag.
The prose is lovely and poetic. It is a bit more "raw" than TDOTS, perhaps reflecting Hippolytus' more straightforward nature and his more open emotion. The voice acting by Dylan is absolutely amazing! It added SO much to the script, and he imbued a lot of emotion into each line, really conveying the anguish that Hippolytus feels as he struggles to overcome his past.
The art is gorgeously rendered (as per usual, of course). I like the muted hues of the field that Hippolytus lies in at the start of the game; the somewhat brown-green color makes it look as if the field is about to wilt, conveying the melancholic state of mind Hippolytus is in at the start of the game. I believe that the flowers in the back are black dahlias, representing betrayal and sadness - a very fitting flower for this story.
The ripple effect as Hippolytus stares into the water is a very nice touch! I love the way the same image was altered in order to convey different moods; it was very creative, and a very good "technical successor" to TDOTS, which used similar effects (different color matrices to use the same sprite for three different characters). The initial, blue-tinged palette as Hippolytus stares into the water paints him with an air of melancholy and casts his skin in a gray-tinge (making him look like a corpse - perhaps reflecting how Phaedra's actions have doomed him, or foreshadowing his imminent death). When Hippolytus reflects on happier times and his father's achievements, the color returns to his face, and he looks "alive" again. Then, when he finally gains his resolve, he turns monochromatic, with a yellow tinge, in a style similar to TDOTS. This perhaps reflects his single-minded determination (while the yellow color harkens back to his "sun god" blood? Or perhaps likening him to the sun - a bright and positive force?)
I love the amount of nuance in Hippolytus' characterization that you get in this game, his pride, his ideas of masculinity, his conflicted feelings towards his father. (Also the aromanticism was portrayed very well - it really is bone-chilling when he begins to discuss Phaedra's advances towards him.)
=== SPOILERS FOR BOTH SON OF THE WOODS AND THE DAUGHTERS OF THE SUN BELOW ===
While this game is excellent on its own, I think that it's much more interesting to compare it to TDOTS, which contains the ruminations of Phaedra, the other tragic figure in this tale. In TDOTS, after remembering the tragedies of her mother and sister, Phaedra begins to recount her own tragedy. From the start, she blames Aphrodite for her wicked desires for her stepson, before finally blaming the sun, her grandfather, for bringing Aphrodite's wrath on their family. In TDOTS, she is painted as a sympathetic figure, one who cannot resist her fate. But then we play Son of the Woods.
From the start, Hippolytus blames himself for Phaedra's feelings. "I channeled such feelings into my stepmother's heart." He then blames Aphrodite for cursing him, despite his aromantic identity, and then Phaedra, for inflicting such horrific feelings upon him. However, when he calms down, he ultimately blames himself for Phaedra's affections and his current miserable state for his inability to kill her. At the end, he is in a state of peace and quiet resolve. He wants to leave this dirty past behind him, despite the trauma, and, if not, he wants to kill Phaedra with his own hands for her misdeeds.
If you compare the two, you have an intriguing picture. In the actual story, Phaedra is the protagonist, but she is also the villain. She is the abuser, the one who brings misery to Hippolytus, her victim. However, in these games, Phaedra paints herself only as the victim of cruel fate, while Hippolytus takes accountability for his actions (even though he was not to blame to begin with). Phaedra resigns herself to her misery, killing herself at the end of TDOTS, while Hippolytus decides to live on, resolving to deal with his problems himself instead of fleeing from them. In TDOTS, Phaedra tells her own story, and she paints herself as a sympathetic victim. But when you compare her to Hippolytus in SOTW, she looks much less sympathetic - a person who blames others for her actions, who takes no action to change her own fate.
Overall, I REALLY enjoyed this! It was a perfect follow-up to TDOTS, building upon it both in terms of characterization and technicalities. It's INCREDIBLY clever how the dev managed to actually affect how you interpret TDOTS simply from playing this game, and I'm really looking forward to playing the last game in the trilogy!
You overall caught Hippolytus very well: he is indeed a more raw character than Phaedra, which reflected in the lines (he's a "son of the woods" unable to love, a beast if anything to most eyes; and he himself embraces this side of him, he is proud of not subjecting to the shameful trials of love).
I'm also glad you appreciated I tried to make the game similar to TDOTS in spirit, despite using different features! Simple effects can convey a lot of things!
I also have nothing to add to the parallelism you noticed between Phaedra (putting the blame on everyone and everything that isn't her) and Hippolytus (self-blaming himself).
Thanks once again, I'm happy you enjoyed the game (and the voice-acting, I am also very pleased with Dylan's performance!!)
Hats off to the VA, the way they sold the ANGER, i was DELIGHTED 🤭💕💕💕
I loved the clash between Hippolytus's self-image as this virtuous, love-loathing person and the reality of being confessed to by his stepmother, and how it shattered his pride (but on the other hand, how virtuous of him to seek fault in himself, first!) (i also liked the clash of his cute appearance and the violent emotions hhhhhhh)
You've got a knack for tragedy, Chim, i liked this a lot. 👌
Wow, thanks Hiro!!! Dylan did a super job with Hippolytus' anger! I am also glad you enjoyed the contrasts and how Phaedra's confession broke both his pride and his sense of self-perception!
I do love tragedies (and especially Phaedra's), hehe, so this really means a lot coming from you, thanks Hiro!!!
I knew I was in for a ride of emotions with this being the sequel to The Daughters of the Sun, but I didn't know quite how many different trips you'd send me on, nor the sheer power you'd be able to convey through this.
CAN I JUST SAY ONE THING. LIKE. THE WRITING IN THIS??? IT'S ABSOLUTELY GORGEOUS???? It literally feels like it should come right out of a play. I can picture this as a climactic soliloquy in some kind of ancient Greek play. The language used, the poetic quality to everything, the flow of the words. And double that up with the performance of the VA, which was absolutely AMAZING. Literally so much emotion behind every single line. The raw power especially in some of the build-up. This whole game feels like taking a small peek into an epic and dramatic stageplay lkdjfalskdfa
I'm in love with how you portrayed Hippolytus here. I feel like there's this real connection even to today's day and age, this quick resolve to blame yourself despite being the victim. To assume that HE must have somehow caused Phaedra to feel this way. That it must be something that HE did. Which is so so similar to what so many people even today say about victims -- that surely the victim must have done something to make their attacker do whatever they did to them. And even the victims blaming themselves, wishing they could have only done something differently and that they're at fault, when that couldn't be further from the truth. My heart really went out for Hippolytus, especially as he kept twisting and convoluting the narrative to search for something that wasn't there -- something he did but shouldn't have. Because he didn't do anything at all. He was just living his life.
I enjoyed the resolve he reached at the end. I had no idea what the final outcome would be (and perhaps assumed it would end up being horrifically tragic LDKJFALD), but I liked the turn it took with him deciding to leave and then the POWER behind that one scene when the sword appeared behind him. It was such a strong lasting image and tone to end the game with!! And it makes me want to continue with Hippolytus on his journey to wherever he goes.
The art in this was absolutely lovely! I really enjoyed the first scene with the soft BG and the parallax. It was a good setup to then lead into the reflection image, which was also so symbolic???? BECAUSE HE SPENDS THE GAME LOOKING DEEP INSIDE HIMSELF???? Also because it's so important for us to see these deep emotions that rock him in different ways, so having the nice close-up to really be able to viscerally feel each and every change in his expression and emotion, it was really done so well. And the way the background changed! Whether it was the subtle changes in color or the more obvious little images that appeared in the background to help illustrate parts of the story. It was just enough to keep the scene engaging and changing while not taking the focus away from the star of the show front and center. Lovely choice of music too! I enjoyed when it changed to the quicker, almost more violent-sounding tune as Hippolytus's emotions built and built and built (which, especially when accompanied by the building of emotion in the VA's voice, was doubly effective lkadjfad).
Overall just fantastic. You do such an amazing job of not only imbuing your stuff with these raw powerful feelings, but also keeping this incessant building of those feelings all throughout. I also just love how you're introducing me to all these stories that I would have never heard of before and filling them with your own thoughts and passions alkdsjfasd Literally everything you put out effects me in such a deep guttural way SOB.
Aaaah, thanks for your detailed feedback, Carrot!! I'm so glad you enjoyed the writing, but it's actually inspired by a theatre play, so that's why it once again looks theatrical dfvgfdfgfdfv (admittedly there's much more of me in this game but dfvfdf).
I'm glad you enjoyed Hippolytus' characterisation, my guideline for this character was: "victim-blaming himself (+) aroace", and I wanted to explore this type of thoughts, as they are destructive. In the end, Hippolytus chooses to leave and rebuild himself by his own means, which I am far from finding perfect, but my boy is trying his best!
(Now, I have to say for full transparence that... Hippolytus actually dies after this... In the myth, when he reaches the sea, a monster emerges from it, which Hippolytus manages to kill; however, his frightened horses become agitated, start galloping, and Hippolytus, falling into the reins, is dragged by them and torn to pieces by the rocks... and that's also one of reasons - amongst those you rightfully mentioned - he's facing the water: he's facing his death... so, basically, I wanted the game to feel empowering to those who didn't know the myth, but to really sound tragic for those who know it)
And thank you! The assets were difficult to product as they were produced during seasonal depression (lol), but I'm glad they work in-game! Now that I'm slowly getting out of it, I do start liking them more again edtgvg (and yes, Dylan did an AMAZING job as the VA!!!!)
Finally, I'm happy that you're discovering all these stories!! I put a lot of me in them, but in the end, the myth of Phaedra really is something important to me (and Racine's play certainly the most striking thing I've ever encountered in my life), and I'm glad to see it can be appreciated, and that it just needs to be better-known!! And FRVGBVTFRTG SOBBING AGAIN I'M SORRY CARROT, but I'm glad the game found an echo in you!
Once again, thanks for your long, detailed feeback, it's always a deligh to read!
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Hey, I watched your video, thank you SO MUCH for sharing your reactions to the game, it's always a pleasure to read!! And I have to agree, Dylan did a STELLAR job on Hippolytus! I hope part 3 doesn't disappoint, it's definitely the most dramatic of the three lol!
Aw damn, the contrast between Hippolytus as this brave, proud young man, but still so innocent and naive that he doesn't even know what to do with Phaedra's twisted affection and even victim blamed himself for her feelings, is just so poignant. There may be more to the story, but I feel for him in this moment 😔
But for now, I read his reluctance in killing Phaedra to be out of fear, yes, perhaps pity, but also a sliver of kindness. Because, aside from this twisted affection, she's still just any other woman. His step-mother, no less. She's not a beast. Not a monster. Just a flawed woman with a twisted affection. She doesn't deserve to be killed. Not even rapists of the highest degree are sentenced to death. What she needs is therapy and rehabilitation. As they say, hate the sin, not the sinner.
I've struggled with that mindset myself. After all, I've been and am abused and want nothing more but punishment to those who have wronged me. But... It's true that we are all still human in the end. Every one of us deserves a second chance ( well, within reasons, lol ). Punishments, death sentences, those are just an easy way out...
Ofc, all victims and survivors still have the right to exercise their boundaries, which means they don't have to forgive those abusers nor even breathe the same air as them. No one can nor should talk them into it either. It's 100% their right and choice to make. The sinner's redemption shall not and will never be the victim/survivor's responsibility to see through.
That's what Phaedra pushed onto Hippolytus. She chose to take an easy way out. She wanted Hippolytus to take responsibility. When it's supposed to be her sin and hers alone.
And this is how Hippolytus wound up blaming himself. Amidst all his confusion and fear and failure in felling her, he directed all that frustration onto himself. After all, what is an easier target but yourself?
Haa, yep, very relatable story to me. Fortunately, I've never been taken advantage of in that way by a family member, but yeah, many similar cycles when it comes to familial abuse.
I feel for him. I wish I could reach out and hug him. Tell him it's not his fault. Tell him it's not his reponsibility to help Phaedra get her easy way out. Tell him that it's okay. Everything will be okay.
As for my opinion on the first entry now; I'm disappointed but not surprised Phaedra killed herself. From the first moment of rejection, she was looking for an easy way out for her feelings and harassment. Although at the very least, I'm glad she didn't wait around for Hippolytus to kill her. That she at least realized what she did was wrong.
And I guess that's the tragedy. Instead of improving herself, instead of apologizing and talking things through, to then live with the guilt of her sin, she chose to end the chapter of her life. Her easy way out.
At least, that's the way I see it.
I'm also shocked to find out Ariadne killed herself. She didn't deserve that, goddammit :' )
But yeah, this one is even more impactful than the first, Chim! So hella bravo! Congrats on slipping my hypeman mask for a sec and peeked at the person beneath 😝 Solid 10/10 for the writing! 🥳✨💞
For the art direction~ Holy heck! How did you do the part with the sun going all ripply?! That was hella cool and intense!! I need a tutorial ahsjksls-- 😭🤲🏻💞💞 But yeah! I love most of the art direction! Even better than the first one! I do wonder what's the purpose of the Hippolytus parallax effect tho? Owo Breaks immersion a bit for me, but nothing major, so is okie 😁👌🏻✨
The voice acting? To be honest, at first the delivery was quite rough and sounded like the VA was trying too hard to sound dramatic, but throughout the game, I could hear the VA actually improving on their delivery and the parts where they yell were actually truly intense! So mad props on that! Improving within just one project takes real skill, so yeh! Am impressed 😳👌🏻✨💞
As for improvement feedback~ The music volume issue is there, ofc, so I won't comment on it further. Unfortunately, it also extends to the voice acting volume. Probably because you were trying to balance it out with the yelling parts? But yeah, it resulted in the non-yelling parts sounding really low, even at 100%. There were even parts where I could barely hear the voice at all. Not sure if you've fixed it for the last entry, but I'll say it here anyway, seeing as the music volume issue persisted 🙉🤲🏻
But good news! This time, I didn't catch any typos! So major props for that! This is enough proof* that you can fight the curse, yayy!! 🥳✨💞
So yeah, really impactful sequel, Chim! You made me feel things! How dare agshsk-- 😭🤲🏻💦✨💞 Another 9.5/10 game for me 😌👌🏻💞💞
Now, what things shall I unearth when I play the last one tomorrow... Lowkey scared, but also hyped 👀💦✨💞
*Edited for a typo. Goddammit-- I guess your curse transferred to me, smh 😤😤
Aaaah, thanks for your detailed feedback!
Your reading is very interesting here! Admittedly, this whole series is meant to be up to interpretation but your take is surprisingly empathetic towards Phaedra. It does make sense though: what I got from abuse is that, even when you see your abusers commit the most inhuman things, you also see how vulnerable they are. And while I think that nobody is unsavable (and that Phaedra deserves her rehabilitation), I do also believe that the victims aren't the one who need to save their abusers (not that you said that lol just sharing my thoughts).
And yes, Phaedra's sucicide even has one more consequence: she took it from Hippolytus, she stole the resolve he takes at the end of Son of the Woods (however, if I'm being honest, Hippolytus dies right after this game, hence the final background, with the sword stained with blood and the wave; it's the tragedy reaching him no matter what, and the wave is connected to the way he dies in the myth: dragged down by his horses, frightened of the sea monster Hippolytus just killed; players are free to interpret the ending as they wish, but I'll admit that's what I have in mind lol).
I'm glad you appreciated Hippolytus enough to want to comfort him, haha. For Ariadne, there are two versions of the myth: the most famous one narrates her marrying Dionysus, god of wine-making; however, another version, which is the one Racine followed in his play and that I followed myself here, is Ariadne committing suicide out of despair after being abandoned by Theseus, for whom she betrayed her father and her country (yeah, Ariadne would definitely deserve her own game loool).
For the voice acting, I'll admit I don't know how to make the volume of the voice lines louder without having it sound saturated, but yes, the issue will exist in nthe whole series efrgvbf; and for the wavy effect, I used Wattson's Ren'Py Wave Shader (cf. credits), but I'm glad you appreciated the effect!
Thanks for your feedback, excited to hear what you have to say of the final game! Hopefully you'll enjoy it, it sure is a wild ride (and is also longer than the two others combined haha).
Aaa, sorry for the late reply! Expected to reply and play the last part yesterday, but life really has a way of throwing you for a loop ahsjsl-- 🥴🤲🏻💦✨
But anyways! Yeah, I tend to be empathetic towards most people, so it's hard to ignore the vulnerable parts of Phaedra. It's one of my flaws, tbh. I get easily taken advantage of because of it. Now I overcompensate by NOT trusting a lot of real people, haha... Still trying to heal from it 😩🤲🏻
Oh no! Poor Hippolytus! Guy can't catch a break agsjsl-- 😭😭 Yeah, I can imagine he won't like Phaedra just killing herself from it cuz he already resolved himself to. If I were him, I'd be relieved, hence why I didn't think about that from the get go. Def fits his prideful personality better 😁👌🏻✨
Omg, yes! Ariadne deserves her own game for sure!! She's only side roles in these two entries but she already caught my heart, man 😭🤲🏻💞💞
I see! Damn. Ren'py sounds complicated than I initially thought. Major glad I decided to use RPG Maker MZ instead. Volume control is easier there 😂👉🏻👈🏻 And guess I can't use the shader when it's limited to Ren'py then. Oh well~ Still hella cool. I legit jumped in awe when it happened 😌👌🏻✨💞
You're welcome! Tbh, I'm still a bit drained from yesterday's life shenanigans ( since what happened could throw a wrench in my future, lol ), so I'm not sure if I'll have the energy to give feedback, but I'll see what I can do! Even if it's short or something 🥰💞 But I have no doubts I'll enjoy it, that's for sure! 😁🤲🏻✨💞
This was a terrific sequel to Daughters of the Sun! The voice actor did an excellent job and the writing was great! Hippolytus is such an interesting character, especially when you compare him to Phaedra. Phaedra blames Aphrodite for her feelings and for what happened to her mother and sister. While Phaedra is somewhat sympathetic, she is the one who fell in love with her own stepson, and seems to see herself as the victim. The real victim, Hippolytus, while also blaming Aphrodite and Phaedra, blames himself for the most part, wondering what he did to cause Phaedra to fall in love with him and upset that he couldn't strike her down like his father struck down her brother, the Minotaur. It's sad to see, especially because other victims in similar situations also tend to blame themselves instead of their attackers. This was heart wrenching but such a good game!
Hi again and thanks for your enthusiasm about the sequel!! You exactly caught it: The Daughters of the Sun is meant to paint Phaedra as a victim of a curse, and then Son of the Woods is meant to question this: is Phaedra trying to find excuses? Isn't Hippolytus the actual victim in this situation? Which is even more ironic considering Hippolytus, here, does see himself as a culprit, when he is, as you say "the real victim". And you also caught the deeper theme of it: self-inflicted victim-blaming.
I'm glad you enjoyed this game too, thanks for your support!! (And once again, I agree: the voice acting is excellent, Dylan was terrific in this role!!)
I spoke at length about the story in my recording of it lol (half the runtime was just me yapping lololol) but for those wondering if they should play-in short, absolutely! especially if you’ve played its predecessor “Daughters of the Sun”
I personally feel more attached to this part of the Phaedra tale as it captures a more relatable protagonist. And though it was horrifically beautiful to witness Phaedra's thoughts in DOTS it didn’t speak to me as much as Son of the Woods. It may sound silly to say with the gorgeous art and writing, but the sound design on this really shines to me! It really sucks you in how the darkest of thoughts find us in the safest/most serene places.
I am genuinely shocked that this project is shorter than DOTS- as I felt like they had the same runtime at the least! (Comparisons aside)
As its own piece of work, this is a very RAW entry. It doesn’t shy away with all the emotions that come from being a victim to a horrible crime. And how Hippolytus is no weaker or lesser because of it! It really sparks an important conversation between the biases of female predators to male.
I feel for Hippolytus and how he wants to “take responsibility” for his step mothers heinous actions/feelings- but the sad truth is we have no control on how others looks at us, and even how they treat us all the time. Even with all the power, influence, and strength we can all be victims.
Some people may find that last sentence terrifying, and in a way it is, but for me a victim myself- I find it empowering- I’m not alone in this and even if I could slay a Minotaur it could still happen to me.
I know Hippolytus and others like him, with the correct support system can come to terms with what happened and not blame himself- as well as not let others blame him.
As I said before, Chime thank you for tackling these heavy subjects with tact and thought! I can always tell you care what you are talking about and take a lot of responsibility with what you are saying! It’s one of the many things I admire about you and your body of work 💕
Ah, thanks for your insighftul comment, Joy, it was a delight to read, and I'm glad you enjoyed this game!
It was the point of the game: I know Phaedra's perception was vastly appreciated by the players of the Daughters of the Sun, sympathising with her, so this game is meant to offer the other side of the story and subvert the initial one! And I'm glad you could connect more with Hippolytus, because in the end, he is the victim after all. Also, thanks for noticing the sound design, I put efforts in it, haha!
Yes, the ending of the game is meant to be powerful, it's Hippolytus gaining agency over his abuse (well, in the actual myth, he dies while leaving Troezen but let's ignore that edfvgfedfvg).
And THANKS FOR THESE KIND FINAL WORDS, it makes me so happy, especially from someone who tackles relationships with so many nuances and care!! Thanks for your support, like always, Joy!!
This was an excellent follow-up to The Daughters of the Sun - the other half of the story, one that casts the former in a completely new light. I'll reserve my detailed comments on the game below, under the spoiler tag.
The prose is lovely and poetic. It is a bit more "raw" than TDOTS, perhaps reflecting Hippolytus' more straightforward nature and his more open emotion. The voice acting by Dylan is absolutely amazing! It added SO much to the script, and he imbued a lot of emotion into each line, really conveying the anguish that Hippolytus feels as he struggles to overcome his past.
The art is gorgeously rendered (as per usual, of course). I like the muted hues of the field that Hippolytus lies in at the start of the game; the somewhat brown-green color makes it look as if the field is about to wilt, conveying the melancholic state of mind Hippolytus is in at the start of the game. I believe that the flowers in the back are black dahlias, representing betrayal and sadness - a very fitting flower for this story.
The ripple effect as Hippolytus stares into the water is a very nice touch! I love the way the same image was altered in order to convey different moods; it was very creative, and a very good "technical successor" to TDOTS, which used similar effects (different color matrices to use the same sprite for three different characters). The initial, blue-tinged palette as Hippolytus stares into the water paints him with an air of melancholy and casts his skin in a gray-tinge (making him look like a corpse - perhaps reflecting how Phaedra's actions have doomed him, or foreshadowing his imminent death). When Hippolytus reflects on happier times and his father's achievements, the color returns to his face, and he looks "alive" again. Then, when he finally gains his resolve, he turns monochromatic, with a yellow tinge, in a style similar to TDOTS. This perhaps reflects his single-minded determination (while the yellow color harkens back to his "sun god" blood? Or perhaps likening him to the sun - a bright and positive force?)
I love the amount of nuance in Hippolytus' characterization that you get in this game, his pride, his ideas of masculinity, his conflicted feelings towards his father. (Also the aromanticism was portrayed very well - it really is bone-chilling when he begins to discuss Phaedra's advances towards him.)
=== SPOILERS FOR BOTH SON OF THE WOODS AND THE DAUGHTERS OF THE SUN BELOW ===
While this game is excellent on its own, I think that it's much more interesting to compare it to TDOTS, which contains the ruminations of Phaedra, the other tragic figure in this tale. In TDOTS, after remembering the tragedies of her mother and sister, Phaedra begins to recount her own tragedy. From the start, she blames Aphrodite for her wicked desires for her stepson, before finally blaming the sun, her grandfather, for bringing Aphrodite's wrath on their family. In TDOTS, she is painted as a sympathetic figure, one who cannot resist her fate. But then we play Son of the Woods.
From the start, Hippolytus blames himself for Phaedra's feelings. "I channeled such feelings into my stepmother's heart." He then blames Aphrodite for cursing him, despite his aromantic identity, and then Phaedra, for inflicting such horrific feelings upon him. However, when he calms down, he ultimately blames himself for Phaedra's affections and his current miserable state for his inability to kill her. At the end, he is in a state of peace and quiet resolve. He wants to leave this dirty past behind him, despite the trauma, and, if not, he wants to kill Phaedra with his own hands for her misdeeds.
If you compare the two, you have an intriguing picture. In the actual story, Phaedra is the protagonist, but she is also the villain. She is the abuser, the one who brings misery to Hippolytus, her victim. However, in these games, Phaedra paints herself only as the victim of cruel fate, while Hippolytus takes accountability for his actions (even though he was not to blame to begin with). Phaedra resigns herself to her misery, killing herself at the end of TDOTS, while Hippolytus decides to live on, resolving to deal with his problems himself instead of fleeing from them. In TDOTS, Phaedra tells her own story, and she paints herself as a sympathetic victim. But when you compare her to Hippolytus in SOTW, she looks much less sympathetic - a person who blames others for her actions, who takes no action to change her own fate.
Overall, I REALLY enjoyed this! It was a perfect follow-up to TDOTS, building upon it both in terms of characterization and technicalities. It's INCREDIBLY clever how the dev managed to actually affect how you interpret TDOTS simply from playing this game, and I'm really looking forward to playing the last game in the trilogy!
Thanks for your detailed feedback, Chatter!
You overall caught Hippolytus very well: he is indeed a more raw character than Phaedra, which reflected in the lines (he's a "son of the woods" unable to love, a beast if anything to most eyes; and he himself embraces this side of him, he is proud of not subjecting to the shameful trials of love).
I'm also glad you appreciated I tried to make the game similar to TDOTS in spirit, despite using different features! Simple effects can convey a lot of things!
I also have nothing to add to the parallelism you noticed between Phaedra (putting the blame on everyone and everything that isn't her) and Hippolytus (self-blaming himself).
Thanks once again, I'm happy you enjoyed the game (and the voice-acting, I am also very pleased with Dylan's performance!!)
Whoa, this one packed a PUNCH!
Hats off to the VA, the way they sold the ANGER, i was DELIGHTED 🤭💕💕💕
I loved the clash between Hippolytus's self-image as this virtuous, love-loathing person and the reality of being confessed to by his stepmother, and how it shattered his pride (but on the other hand, how virtuous of him to seek fault in himself, first!) (i also liked the clash of his cute appearance and the violent emotions hhhhhhh)
You've got a knack for tragedy, Chim, i liked this a lot. 👌
Wow, thanks Hiro!!! Dylan did a super job with Hippolytus' anger! I am also glad you enjoyed the contrasts and how Phaedra's confession broke both his pride and his sense of self-perception!
I do love tragedies (and especially Phaedra's), hehe, so this really means a lot coming from you, thanks Hiro!!!
GOD YOU REALLY NEVER DISAPPOINT?????
I knew I was in for a ride of emotions with this being the sequel to The Daughters of the Sun, but I didn't know quite how many different trips you'd send me on, nor the sheer power you'd be able to convey through this.
CAN I JUST SAY ONE THING. LIKE. THE WRITING IN THIS??? IT'S ABSOLUTELY GORGEOUS???? It literally feels like it should come right out of a play. I can picture this as a climactic soliloquy in some kind of ancient Greek play. The language used, the poetic quality to everything, the flow of the words. And double that up with the performance of the VA, which was absolutely AMAZING. Literally so much emotion behind every single line. The raw power especially in some of the build-up. This whole game feels like taking a small peek into an epic and dramatic stageplay lkdjfalskdfa
I'm in love with how you portrayed Hippolytus here. I feel like there's this real connection even to today's day and age, this quick resolve to blame yourself despite being the victim. To assume that HE must have somehow caused Phaedra to feel this way. That it must be something that HE did. Which is so so similar to what so many people even today say about victims -- that surely the victim must have done something to make their attacker do whatever they did to them. And even the victims blaming themselves, wishing they could have only done something differently and that they're at fault, when that couldn't be further from the truth. My heart really went out for Hippolytus, especially as he kept twisting and convoluting the narrative to search for something that wasn't there -- something he did but shouldn't have. Because he didn't do anything at all. He was just living his life.
I enjoyed the resolve he reached at the end. I had no idea what the final outcome would be (and perhaps assumed it would end up being horrifically tragic LDKJFALD), but I liked the turn it took with him deciding to leave and then the POWER behind that one scene when the sword appeared behind him. It was such a strong lasting image and tone to end the game with!! And it makes me want to continue with Hippolytus on his journey to wherever he goes.
The art in this was absolutely lovely! I really enjoyed the first scene with the soft BG and the parallax. It was a good setup to then lead into the reflection image, which was also so symbolic???? BECAUSE HE SPENDS THE GAME LOOKING DEEP INSIDE HIMSELF???? Also because it's so important for us to see these deep emotions that rock him in different ways, so having the nice close-up to really be able to viscerally feel each and every change in his expression and emotion, it was really done so well. And the way the background changed! Whether it was the subtle changes in color or the more obvious little images that appeared in the background to help illustrate parts of the story. It was just enough to keep the scene engaging and changing while not taking the focus away from the star of the show front and center. Lovely choice of music too! I enjoyed when it changed to the quicker, almost more violent-sounding tune as Hippolytus's emotions built and built and built (which, especially when accompanied by the building of emotion in the VA's voice, was doubly effective lkadjfad).
Overall just fantastic. You do such an amazing job of not only imbuing your stuff with these raw powerful feelings, but also keeping this incessant building of those feelings all throughout. I also just love how you're introducing me to all these stories that I would have never heard of before and filling them with your own thoughts and passions alkdsjfasd Literally everything you put out effects me in such a deep guttural way SOB.
Aaaah, thanks for your detailed feedback, Carrot!! I'm so glad you enjoyed the writing, but it's actually inspired by a theatre play, so that's why it once again looks theatrical dfvgfdfgfdfv (admittedly there's much more of me in this game but dfvfdf).
I'm glad you enjoyed Hippolytus' characterisation, my guideline for this character was: "victim-blaming himself (+) aroace", and I wanted to explore this type of thoughts, as they are destructive. In the end, Hippolytus chooses to leave and rebuild himself by his own means, which I am far from finding perfect, but my boy is trying his best!
(Now, I have to say for full transparence that... Hippolytus actually dies after this... In the myth, when he reaches the sea, a monster emerges from it, which Hippolytus manages to kill; however, his frightened horses become agitated, start galloping, and Hippolytus, falling into the reins, is dragged by them and torn to pieces by the rocks... and that's also one of reasons - amongst those you rightfully mentioned - he's facing the water: he's facing his death... so, basically, I wanted the game to feel empowering to those who didn't know the myth, but to really sound tragic for those who know it)
And thank you! The assets were difficult to product as they were produced during seasonal depression (lol), but I'm glad they work in-game! Now that I'm slowly getting out of it, I do start liking them more again edtgvg (and yes, Dylan did an AMAZING job as the VA!!!!)
Finally, I'm happy that you're discovering all these stories!! I put a lot of me in them, but in the end, the myth of Phaedra really is something important to me (and Racine's play certainly the most striking thing I've ever encountered in my life), and I'm glad to see it can be appreciated, and that it just needs to be better-known!! And FRVGBVTFRTG SOBBING AGAIN I'M SORRY CARROT, but I'm glad the game found an echo in you!
Once again, thanks for your long, detailed feeback, it's always a deligh to read!